Interview: Elijah Bynum (2013 Black List) — Part 5

The Black List is a pretty exclusive club, especially so for those writers who manage to land two scripts on the List in a single year. That’s what Elijah Bynum did in 2013 when two of his original screenplays — “Mississippi Mud” and “Hot Summer Nights”. I sought out Elijah to see what sort of creative mind could manage that feat. He was kind enough to give me an hour of his time in what turned out to be a great conversation about storytelling and the craft of screenwriting.

Today in Part 5, Elijah reflects on his love/hate relationship with plot and what it was like to learn two of his scripts made the Black List:

Scott: Of course, working at CAA and reading all the scripts you did, you’re quite aware of these supposed screenwriting rules: “Don’t use voice‑over narration or don’t use flashbacks.” Even period pieces. From a budgetary standpoint, it’s just more expensive.

Yet you embrace all of that. You’ve got fantasy elements. You’ve got voice‑over narration. You’ve got flashbacks. Were you at all concerned about the conventional wisdom that’s out there about these things? Or this was part of your mythic, fantastical vision for the story and you just had to go with it?

Elijah: I didn’t worry about it too much, just because I had such a clear vision of what the script was going to play like. At the end of the day I was writing the story for myself. I knew it would turn some people off but I didn’t care. If I wanted to make everyone happy I would make ice cream.

I feel like rules are allowed to be broken if they’re broken well.

Scott: I’d like to talk about both movies, look at them in macro and think about, discuss maybe your creative instincts here because I don’t know if you’re a fan of Coen brothers or not, but to me, Raising Arizona came to mind. Fargo came to mind. At moments, even Blood Simple. Are you a fan of the Coen brothers? Inspiration for you?

Elijah: They are literally my favorite filmmakers of all time.

Scott: Were there some touchstones for you thematically or tonally with some of the Coen brothers movies that came to mind? Or were you just sort of generally influenced by them and didn’t have any specific points of reference?

Elijah: I think I’m generally influenced by them. They have this almost magical way of exploring life in ways that are beautiful and tragic and hilarious and horribly sad and deeply ironic. After all that’s what life is. A Coen brother movie leaves me with a very particular feeling in my gut. It’s something that I’ve always been inspired by.

“Mississippi Mud,” absolutely. I mean, “Mississippi Mud” is very much, I think, in the tone of Fargo and Blood Simple.

“Hot Summer Nights” less so. Movies that inspired “Hot Summer Nights” were movies such as Stand by Me, American Beauty, Goodfellas. I read the novel “Virgin Suicides” as I was writing it as well. Just finding those elements and this detached whimsical nostalgic feeling that’s also tragic and funny and sad, and just felt very human and very, very real.

Scott: Both of your scripts have complex plots with a lot of subplots, twists and turns. Do you like plot?

Elijah: Yes and no. I have an index card taped to my desk that says, “Don’t be boring.” I have to remind myself of that all the time. Any time I feel the plot dragging and I realize I’m going down the wrong path I look down at my desk and that little index card is staring up at me.

Plot by a long shot is the most difficult, frustrating thing, because you only have, unlike a novel, a set amount of pages to tell your story. If you’re following the conventions of screenwriting, you have act breaks that you need to hit generally within a two or three page window to make your story read smoothly.

Being able to juggle all of these pieces while being able to say what you want to say thematically, while being able to say what you want to say on a character level, and keeping the plot moving forward ‑‑ it can be maddening. Whiskey helps.

But when you really tap into it and find a plot line that’s working, it sets you free, because the writing becomes that much easier. You’re connecting the dots at that point, instead of just swimming into the abyss, hoping you find a post to hang onto. You know exactly where you’re going. It’s just finding those benchmarks that are so difficult.

So I’d say it’s a love/ hate relationship with plot.

Scott: One last thing I wanted to talk about in sort of macro way. You’ve got, particularly in “Hot Summer Nights,” there’s quite a few sides of dialogue where characters are ruminating about life. In fact, McKayla has one where she says something like, “Sometimes it’s good to be a little bad.” Even she has her own worldview that gets expressed.

But like “Mississippi Mud,” there’s a line toward the end. “Some folks walk in the rain. Others just get wet.”

I’m curious, and now you’ve also talked about how each of your stories have these kind of thematic, almost philosophical questions at the center of them. Where do you think that comes from and why does that interest you in terms of your writing?

Elijah: I’m not sure that I know where that comes from. My dad is a pretty deep dude. He’s a psychologist and has published several incredibly dense and esoteric non-fiction books on the human subconscious. That could be it. I don’t know, I have always been pretty cerebral and I’m fortunate to be able to string a few words together so I’m able to explore my questions through my stories. One of my favorite novelists is Cormac McCarthy. I think, as dark as he is, he’s always seeking questions to the way that this universe works and where he belongs in it.

There’s a way to address these questions, without hitting them over the head, by having characters, who are just as confused and lost and ponderous about life as I am. Looking at some of my favorite films and what’s inspired me, there’s always that element in there of “why are we here and what are we doing and where do we fit in?”

I think it’s something that influences me, whether I’m trying to let it or not, it comes out in some way or the other.

Scott: Let’s talk about landing two scripts on the 2013 Blacklist. How did that go down? How did you find out?

Elijah: I think a week before someone told me, “Black List is coming out in a week.” And then I tried not to worry about it too much, so I let it out of my mind.

I figured the night before, someone, either Franklin Leonard, or my manager or agent or someone from the Blacklist to tell me. Someone would email me and say, “Congratulations! You’re on the Black List. It will be posted tomorrow.”

The way I found out was this very nice television executive who greeted me with a congratulations. I was going into a general meeting, and the executive I was meeting with, as soon as I sat down, she said, “Well, congratulations!” I had no idea what she was talking about. I stared back at her like an idiot, and said “Thank you…?” She was like, “For the Black List.” “Ohhhh.”

Scott: Did they say, “You’ve got two scripts on there?” Or was it just, “You just made the Black List.”

Elijah: No, no. She said, “Congratulations on the Black List.” Then she refreshed her computer page. I leaned over and looked at her desk. I saw “Hot Summer Nights” was on there.

And then during the course of hour long meeting I felt my phone buzzing in my pocket. I came out and there was a text from someone who said, “Two on the Black List. Congratulations!” And then there were a few more texts that said that, so then I went on Deadline and looked at it. And saw that “Mississippi Mud” made it as well.

Scott: What was it like and has it made much of a difference for you making the Black List in terms of general meetings and whatnot?

Elijah: For six months leading up to the Black List, I was heavily involved in the general meetings. It felt like I was campaigning for a political office.

I think I went on something like a hundred general meetings. Someone told me “well, you’ve already met half the town, now after making the black list you’ll meet the other half”. It’s great — there are so many cool, likeminded people in this industry and I have a ton of water bottles now — but it’s hell on my gas tank.

Aside from the meetings, it really gave me the confidence that what I’m doing is resonating with people. Neither of those scripts were developed with anyone, I wrote them in a vacuum, which can be scary because you’ll stare at a piece of writing and you won’t know if it’s good or not. You have the devil and the angel on each side telling you this is terrible or this is great, and you’ve got to trust your instinct. So it’s very cool to know that people I respect dig my work.

Scott: What’s the status of the scripts, by the way?

Elijah: They’re both technically, I guess you would say, “in development.” “Mississippi Mud” is set up at Darko Entertainment with…

Scott: Richard Kelly.

Elijah: Yeah, with Richard Kelly’s company, with D. J. Caruso attached to direct.

And “Hot Summer Nights” is kind of in an interesting position right now, but it’s being executive produced by a company called Flashlight Pictures.

Scott: Let’s get into some craft questions. How do you come up with story ideas?

Elijah: Like we discussed earlier it comes from a place of some question or theme I want to explore. And then, just by keeping my eyes peeled — listening to music or reading books or articles or documentaries — something will stand out. And it will present itself in such a way that it lends itself to fitting into this theme that I want to write.

I’ve been fortunate enough that I have found those kernels of true life. Even if the script ends up having nothing to do with what that initial inspiration was, there was something there that triggered a creative thought in my mind that I was able to run with.

Scott: How much time do you spend in prep writing?

Elijah: The problem with me is when I have an idea and I have a character, I get really excited. At first, I go, “Well, I’m going to do it right this time. I’m going to outline. I’m going to know exactly what’s going to happen on each page. I’m not going down that path that I did on my other script”.

Then I just get too excited and I start writing. A lot of the research I do comes as I’m writing. I’ll get to a place where our characters need to accomplish X. And I won’t know what X looks like, so then I’ll take a few hours or sometimes a few days and I’ll research X.

But it’s a process that I do concurrently with the writing. I don’t front load everything. I think there are two kinds of people who can know their entire story up front — geniuses and hacks — I don’t think I’m either one. I’m sure there will be a project some point in the future where I really need to delve into the research and the outlining before I even think about writing one word of the script. But so far it hasn’t been that way.

One of my favorite screenwriters to date who I’ve really learned the craft from just from reading his stuff is Eric Warren Singer. A little bird told me that he wrote a script for Sony where he read something like 70 books beforehand. Maybe not cover to cover, but some part of the book and just did three or four months of research before he even started writing the script. I found that to be incredibly awe inspiring, that he went into this world with that much knowledge.

While I might not dive headlong into research I do completely immerse myself in the mood. I don’t know if there is such thing as “method writing” but if there is I think I qualify. During my most recent script — a grim crime thriller — I let my beard grow out and I found myself drinking a lot of whiskey in the dark while listening to Tom Waits. I was in a dark place. During “Hot Summer Nights” I was listening to a lot of 50’s love songs — I even tried to fall in love myself. It didn’t pan out.

Tomorrow in Part 6, Elijah discusses the craft of screenwriting and lays some advice on aspiring writers.

To read Part 1 of the interview, go here.

Part 2, here.

Part 3, here.

Part 4, here.

Elijah is repped at Verve and Kaplan / Perrone.

Twitter: @BynumElijah.

Comment Archive