Interview [Part 3]: Frank DeJohn and David Hedges [2013 Nicholl Winners]

Frank DeJohn and David Hedges are one of five recipients of the 2013 Academy Nicholl Fellowships in Screenwriting for their historical drama screenplay “Legion”. It’s a terrific story set in the latter days of the Roman Empire and garnered a lot of attention for the duo including being hired by A&E to write “The One”, described as a “coming-of-age story of exploring Jesus’ early life and formative years as he comes to learn he is the Son of God and is destined for greatness.”

Frank and David have had an unusual path to Hollywood success, so I was pleased to be able to interview them at length about their respective backgrounds, their script “Legion,” and their approach to the craft of screenwriting.

Today in Part 3, David and Frank delve into the rest of the primary characters in “Legion”:

Scott: You mentioned this twice. Frank mentioned this idea of the Germans being like ghosts. You, David, said, “We need to keep them in the woods.” That’s a really interesting narrative choice. You never break away from the Romans to show the German’s perspective. In fact, you don’t meet their leader until the very end. I was wondering what your thought process was in choosing not to do cutaways to the Germans.

Frank: We tried it both ways. We had written a scene at one point that cut to a warrior and his family, and all the rest of it. It just sapped away the mystery of it. Our idea was that we wanted to give the modern audience the perspective that the Roman soldiers would have had of these warriors from the forest.

There was a mystique about them. They took pride in the fact that they lived in a place full of mystic legends. All of the other tribes were afraid to live there, but not the Germans. They loved it. That was their home. They could live in the wilderness.

Scott: I thought it was something like Jaws where Spielberg didn’t reveal the shark until well into the movie. Create a heightened sense of terror, right?

David: Frank and I both had written horror scripts and monster scripts. I think we thought about what we like about that, and we used some of the same tricks. To go back to your original question, the fort is a lifeboat: they’re floating in an ocean of trees.

It’s as if someone was there with a camera, and no one knows if they’re going to survive. It’s the last three days of their lives, and we’re capturing it all on film. That’s why we stayed there, up close with them.

We attempted to cut away many times. We actually got into a couple of arguments about it. Ultimately we made the decision to never do it unless we were following somebody out, like Ferox.

Frank: Or Mouse.

David: Yes, or Mouse.

Scott: You know what? I think it was a smart choice. I tried to imagine in my head, what if you did cut away to the Germans. In a way, it would demystify them.

David: Quite frankly, it started as a budgetary concern. We wanted to make it one location so it would be more affordable. As we started working we thought, it’s not just a matter of budget, it will be better just to stay with the Romans, so we did.

Scott: There are a couple more characters I want to talk about. You’ve got these two characters who really put a face on what we talked about earlier, the level of respect towards Caelius, and how he bonds with them, connects with them, elevates them.

One is Marius, who we meet as he’s being whipped for insubordination. Another is Pugio, who has an immediate bad attitude towards Caelius and, over time, is won over. Talk a bit more about those two characters, and how they represent the face of that transformation that happens with the men as a whole.

Frank: Marius is an interesting guy. He’s kind of a Billy Bud character. He’s this guy that, after being whipped, volunteers for the suicide mission to go for help. He pays for it horribly when he gets caught and tortured.

Why don’t you tell him about Pugio?

David: There is a type of police officer, a very experienced street cop, who generally is really sour on leadership. They’ve probably been treated poorly over the years. They don’t really like what they do anymore, and probably haven’t for a long time, but they’re good at it. Pugio is this guy.

The trick is, how do you bring out that experience, and make use of it? That was probably the second most challenging character — don’t you think, Frank? — that we had to work with.

Frank: Absolutely.

David: Caelius dealt with him in a way that’s believable, and isn’t syrupy. We’ve been working with Pugio quite a bit in the recent weeks.

Frank: The polish, yes.

David: Everyone knows this guy, no matter what kind of work you do. He’s good at his job, but he’s just sour. He doesn’t like what he does anymore. That’s why everybody recognizes him.

Scott: I like to look at stories from a psychological standpoint, and oftentimes find that characters surrounding the protagonist are reflections of aspects of the protagonist’s psyche. It’s interesting to look at Marius as being a projection of the nobility of Caelius, and Pugio as being the path that Caelius could take. He could go down that cynical, sour path, but he’s chosen not to. This is a way for him to confront that aspect of his own inner voice.

David: Only a guy like Caelius could reach him, because he understands him.

Scott: Yes, he understands him.

David: Caelius is probably more like Pugio at the beginning. Pugio witnesses the transformation that Calius undergoes, and that leads the way for him.

Scott: Then finally, at the very end, Pugio comes around.

David: Yes. And anyone who is still reading wants him to live.

Scott: One of the surprising characters, the last one I want to talk about is Mouse.

Frank: Oh, yes. [laughs]

Scott: Ostensibly, a young boy, who then turns out to be a girl. When I read the script, I thought, “This is perfect.” She functions, really, as a surrogate version of Caelius’ daughter. Is that right?

David: Absolutely.

Frank: She was a boy, of course, when we wrote it. Then we thought, “Why don’t we reverse the gender?” It opened up for us completely.

The little water boy becomes the orphan girl hiding her sex to be with her brother. It adds a different level of emotion to the character. She ultimately becomes, arguably, the most courageous character in the script when she goes off to take the place of her brother, and climb up the tree to stand watch to warn of the approaching Germans.

Scott: Actually, that’s a great object lesson that we should challenge ourselves when we come up with characters, to think, “What if they were the other gender?” Just because, as you said, it did make for a much more interesting character.

David: The risk of writing about Roman soldiers in a fort is it can be aimed just at men. I think a lot of people who haven’t read the script assume that. Mouse is more courageous than any other character in that script. She’s so powerful. I’m glad we did that. Ultimately, it keeps the script from being just a celebration of all things manly. It ends up being more of a study in human courage, something I’ve been observing very closely for many years in my line of work.

Tomorrow in Part 4, Frank and David share their respective experiences when they discovered they had won the Nicholl.

For Part 1 of the interview, go here.

Part 2, here.

David and Frank are repped by UTA and BenderSpink.