Interview (Part 4): Jon Boyer

A conversation with writer whose script made the 2013 Black List.

From professional snowboarder to commercial director to Hollywood screenwriter, Jon Boyer has had an interesting journey taking him from Canada to Los Angeles. Recently I had the opportunity to talk with Jon about his background, his script “Free Byrd” which landed on the 2013 Black List, and his approach to the craft of screenwriting.

Today in Part 4, Jon shares what it was like to have his script make the 2013 Black List:

Scott: It’s interesting, too, some of the choices you made in the story. One of them is really not having your prototypical antagonist character. I guess it’s really the dementia.

Jon: Yeah.

Scott: From a writing standpoint, that’s a net plus. I mean, it’s kind of weird to say that about dementia, but it gives the narrative a nice ticking clock, and then you actually see him devolving. When did the dementia idea come into play?

Jon: It’s funny because I looked at old notes from when I first came up with the idea, just actually recently, and I was laughing at this. It was all about money before and I felt, “No, let’s not leave that in.” He was broke and he was trying to get back all his money. Talk about a lame motivation.

But it’s really tough writing any story that doesn’t have that opposing character that’s the constant pushback. That antagonistic character that just stops you from moving forward. In this story, I tried having a nemesis. I tried having an old business associate or an old something, but nothing felt right.

I tried to have that and it just never fit, and I always thought that, “This guy needs to be his own worst enemy.” He’s the protagonist but, in some ways, his dementia, obviously. He’s also the antagonist because it is time, and nothing is more crushing to anybody than the passing of time when you don’t have any.

Scott: You mentioned earlier that he’d like to go out on his own terms and that, because of the accident he had, he had to hang up his guns, if you will. It’s once the dementia, that news, hits, that he basically sets into motion the inciting incident that, “I’ve got to get my act together,” because he says straight on to Cole. He says, “What do you want to leave when you’re gone?”

He’s asking that to Cole, but isn’t he also asking that of himself?

Jon: Yeah. It’s like him having to say it out loud for it to be real. There’s that confessional moment in the script too. You can think it, and think it, and think it, and we all do that. But, until you actually verbally say something, it doesn’t really land with ourselves. I definitely think that’s something that Billy is feeling right there.

He’s asking himself that, like, “What am I doing? What am I going to leave? What am I going to be remembered by? The crashes? Is that it?”

Scott: There was interesting bit of business where Cole goes online to look at his YouTube videos. He’s comparing number of views, and Billy’s got way more hits. Billy’s thought is that, in part, because he was living so close to the edge and so close to danger.

Jon: Yeah, because there’s legacy there. He’s a legend, there’s a big difference between fame and infamy, or legend. In any sport really. There’s basketball players like Michael Jordan, but there’s still all these new amazing basketball players, and everybody’s like, “Oh, my God. They’re amazing,” but there’s still never going to be another Michael Jordan. There’s never going to be another Wayne Gretzky. There’s never going to be another Tiger woods.

Scott: Yeah.

Jon: There’s always that one person that stands out and does things because they did it first. They didn’t follow anybody. They were the standard.

Scott: Using that kind of Jungian language, that legendary status is kind of a shadow hanging over him. He’s got to confront that, which is eventually what he does in the story, and in a very interesting way. Let me talk to you about that ending. I don’t want to give it away to people who haven’t read it, but you do a very interesting twist with Cole. That really surprised me.

Jon: It surprised a lot of people to the point where a lot of people kept asking, “Why? Why did that have to happen?”

Scott: I can understand why Cole would do it. I mean, I totally get why he would do it, so they’re asking it from the perspective of you as a screenwriter, why did you do that?

Jon: Honestly, I don’t know if I can completely remember exactly why I chose that moment to happen, but I think I wanted something so jarring that it not only jarred the audience, but it jarred Billy. Because he was ready to just give it up again and I needed him to be activated. I needed him to be activated to the point of no return.

You think he’s already got that halfway through the script, which normally, by screenwriting standards, you want that midpoint of “I’m not going to look back,” but I wanted that low point for him also to be this jolt forward like, “If I give up now, I’ll never forgive myself, and I’ll never be able to live tit down.”

Scott: That certainly contributes to that All Is Lost reversal at the end of Act Two.

Jon: Indeed it does.

Scott: Then you’ve got a very lyrical, poignant denouement with Maggie. How soon did that evolve, that you knew that that was where you were going to end the story?

Jon: I knew that ending before I knew the middle of the script. I’ve had this script compared to The Wrestler, and Crazy Heart, but with motorcycles. I’ve heard all these things. Remember, in The Wrestler, you don’t really see him land that rope dive? You just see him jump into the air and that’s it. I struggled for a long time before I wrote the ending, “Do you want to see him actually do this final jump? Is it that important?”

I kept asking myself, “Is that what’s it’s about?” It’s not about that. It’s about the intention. It’s about him learning what really matters in his life, and everybody else around him also learning that about themselves.

I just wanted that ending to leave you with this…You know that pit in your stomach that sense of longing, but happiness and sadness all in one? I really wanted to achieve that and I think I did. [laughs]

Scott: You provided a nice segue there into the business side of things. When this made the semifinals at the Nicholl, were you repped at that point, or no?

Jon: No. I didn’t know anything about how the business worked. I just was trying to write something small I could direct. Everybody always asks, “How did you get an agent?” It’s that same old chestnut which I don’t know how to answer. I was aware of screenplay competitions, but I had never once thought “I’m going to be a screenwriter.” It wasn’t really my goal. Like I said, I initially just wanted to write a small movie I could direct. But I didn’t know how I was going to raise the money. Then one day my wife comes home from work and says a coworker tells her about this screenplay competition called the Nicholl Fellowship done by the Academy Awards.

I looked into it but the deadline was in a month and at that time I literally had a first readable draft. I thought, “Maybe I’ll try to do a rewrite. Maybe I can get a rewrite in and fix some things that I felt were problematic in the script.”

I struggled, and tried to get it done, but maybe got halfway through the draft. I didn’t get it done. I went, “Ah, this sucks. I’m not going to do it.” But my wife tells me, “Whatever. It’s 50 bucks. Just enter it.” So I did and forgot about it. Then, some months later I started to get emails from the Nicholl saying my script had advanced.

I got to admit it was really exciting. It’s not that that I was looking for validation but, without a better term, it was validation that other people have read this and it’s connecting with them, so I was like, “OK, I think I’ve got something.”

I didn’t really understand what it meant until they asked if I minded if they included my name in the list of quarter finalists they send out to managers, producers, and agents. Within four days, my inbox was filling with tons of emails from managers, and producers, and everybody asking to read the script. That’s kind of how it happened.

I’m literally that guy that people who are struggling to become a working screen writer hate. [laughs] I just had that one thing that got in the right hands at the right time. I don’t know what alchemy made that happen, but it landed with a bunch of people. Then my manager, Jeff Belkin from Zero Gravity, he called me and said, “I love the script,” and that was that.

Scott: It’s a testament to something I think most professional screenwriters would tell aspiring screenwriters: Focus on the material. If you get the story in good shape, then the rest of it pretty much will take care of itself.

Jon: Yeah. It seems corny, but it’s so true. It really does matter that, if you’re writing to chase markets, you’re going to fail every time. You have to find that thing that you love and that you can’t not write and write that. I mean, that was “Free Byrd,” for me. It landed in my brain and I couldn’t stop writing. I loved writing it.

If you write something that you just absolutely are passionate about and love, it’s obviously going to be better. And it will connect with people.

Scott: Right. Then you start doing the bottled water tour, and the script gets around, and…

Jon: Yeah. They brought it in and Mark Williams, who’s a producer at Zero Gravity, he read it and attached to produce. Also his brother, Eric Williams, who is my other manager, he read it and wanted to rep me as well.

When we started talking about what to do with the script I told them how I wrote it to direct it. But I was smart enough. I thought, “OK, I’ve got two young children at this time now,” and I’m thinking, “I need to be smart here and not be that guy that goes, ‘I’m making this. This is my movie,’ and alienate everybody.” I thought, “I want to direct it, but I’m not saying that I have to direct it.”

It’s still something that I would like to do and maybe could still happen, but I’m not really focused on that. Then after about a few weeks, my manager called to tell me that Mark took it to the producer, Gil Netter and asked him to read the script.

Gil Netter, if you’re not familiar, he produced, “Life of Pi,” and “The Blind Side.” He said he loved it, that it really landed with him. He wanted to come on board and produce as well. As soon as he came on board, he sent the script it to all the agencies. Next thing I know I have meetings set up with all these agents.

Then came the bottled water tour. Which was really bizarre if I’m being honest. I chuckled the whole time because of how complimentary they were in these meetings. Agents, they want to sign you. They are actually ALL trying to find new talent. It’s funny because everybody asks, “How do you get an agent? How do you get an agent?” Seriuously, there is no one way.

If you write that one good thing, they’ll find you. I really believe that. They all want to find that next great writer, or great script. The next great anything, they want to find that.

I went through that whole tour, and I landed with my agents. They were really great guys, and I loved what they said about the script as a movie. It wasn’t all about, “We’re gonna do this for you.” They kept talking about Free Byrd and how much they loved the project and wanted to make sure it got made. That meant something to me.

Scott: What about when the Black List, when you found out…

Jon: The Black List was crazy because I was completely unaware. I thought, “Oh, very cool.” I remember that day. I’d just recently got back on Twitter. I’d never really been the Twitter guy, and I watched the whole thing and I was cracking some jokes just because it was fun. I was sitting there drinking coffee, watching all the announcements. Then, all of a sudden, I saw my name.

I didn’t know what it meant but was pretty excited. It’s an amazing thing. I know there’s a lot of people that say good things about it, people that say bad things, whatever. I think it’s a very cool thing what Franklin has done. As soon as that happened, then, obviously, a lot more people start calling.

I actually had to tell my [laughs] managers at one point, “Can you stop setting me up with meetings?” It sounds so awful to say that, but those meetings, literally one after the other, and it just shoots your entire week. Then, the next thing you know, you haven’t written anything.

But everything helps. Right? It makes people want to know who you are and what you’re writing, what else you’ve got, what you’re working on, any ideas you have. More than anything, they just want to meet you and see if you’re somebody that they actually want to spend a year of their life working with. That you’re not some socially awkward hermit who they can’t discuss projects with.

Tomorrow in Part 5, Jon shares his thoughts about some key aspects of the screenwriting craft.

For Part 1 of the interview, go here.

Part 2, here.

Part 3, here.

Jon is repped by WME and Zero Gravity Management.

Twitter: @jonboyer.