Interview (Part 6): Jon Boyer

A conversation with writer whose script made the 2013 Black List.

From professional snowboarder to commercial director to Hollywood screenwriter, Jon Boyer has had an interesting journey taking him from Canada to Los Angeles. Recently I had the opportunity to talk with Jon about his background, his script “Free Byrd” which landed on the 2013 Black List, and his approach to the craft of screenwriting.

Today in Part 6, Jon gives advice to aspiring screenwriters:

Scott: What about are your thoughts about theme?

Jon: Oh, God. [laughter]

Scott: I know, right? Because it’s one of those things where nobody really quite has a handle on what theme even means.

Jon: No, I agree. It’s really hard. Theme is something that I think every writer struggles with. I think the biggest struggle is most of us, myself included, you kind of start in this hoitytoity land of getting way too airy about it all, and trying to have this deep meaning, and it being so profound, and that’s where I think we as writers can get stuck. And I do it every time.

When I meet aspiring writers or people that ask me about this, theme is always a point of struggle. And we commiserate about it. [laughs]

I always try to think of a good example that I try to give is Spiderman. It’s an easy one. We all know the character. In the first Spiderman, ‘With great power comes great responsibility.’ That’s a great theme, and it’s really simple. It’s a good one to reverse engineer into your own story.

Sometimes it’s just a simple thing, like with Free Byrd it was, ”What’s our footprint? What do we leave behind?” I think that makes it a lot easier if you try to simplify things. But fuck, theme is a struggle, man.

Every single script I write, and I know you know that too, that it’s so brutal. You can see it pretty quickly if there’s no theme. If there’s nothing in the script that gives us as an audience, something to universally connect to, it becomes apparent pretty quickly and then you go put your head in the oven. [laughs]

Scott: Yeah, you don’t have that emotional meaning. The stories can lack that.

Jon: Yeah, and whether it’s an ensemble piece, or a single character, or two characters, I think you just have to find that one thing. The 50 moments exercise I do, what my character goes through, doing little exercises like that with your characters can help find theme a lot of times. Sometimes you might not even see it.

Like, “What does your character want? Where do they want to go? What’s their goal?” Those things can help find theme, I think.

Scott: What about writing a scene? What are your goals in writing a scene?

Jon: That it doesn’t suck.[laughter]

I always try to come from a point of character intention. I think of that great scene in 21 Grams, where Sean Penn, his character, he’s sleeping in the car outside of Naomi Watts’s house and she sees him. She comes out there and it’s this two minute scene that is just absolutely astounding.

You look at something like that and you think, “Each one of these people want something different than the other one. They’re trying to make the other person see that. Then the other one is trying to stop them.” It’s a push and pull.

You can look at it as simple as that. One person wants has something, and they don’t want to give it to the other person, and vice versa. That other person just has to get it from them.

Scott: Just by looking at and framing a scene, saying, “Somebody wants something. Somebody has something. Somebody wants to get something,” now you’re in the realm of conflict.

Jon: Yeah. The obvious way to look at it is: One character has a gun; the other character doesn’t have a gun; that character needs to get that gun. You can do that same thing with anything. Someone loves someone else. All they want is that person to say, “I love you” but no matter what, that other person doesn’t want to say it. you can come up with some pretty interesting moments in a very economical way with something like that. I think it’s just important to focus on it’s a push and pull throughout in every scene.

Not every scene is like that, obviously. If it’s just one person by themselves, and it’s just a quick window into something, again, just make it mean something. The thing that I notice the most about scripts that I read that are very underdeveloped is there’s a lot of scenes that have a lot of pretty dialog, and it sounds good, but it doesn’t mean anything. It’s a waste of a page.

Every actor will look at that, and the first thing that they will ask a writer or director is, “What does this character want here?” If you can’t answer it, then the actor’s not going to be able to find it. That’s the thing. Every scene, there has to be a goal.

Scott: So let me ask you, what do you love most about writing?

Jon: [laughs] That’s a loaded question, man. Love most about writing? Well, I guess, like everybody that writes, I love it at times, and I hate it at times. I think the thing I love most about it is that making something up out of nothing is really hard. But when you have those little victories, as a writer, nothing feels better. I think that is one of the big things for me, is just being able to create something out of nothing that may one day entertain, inspire someone, horrify them, or make them laugh or cry. Being able to achieve that is pretty special.

Scott: Let’s end with this. It’s a question I always ask. I’m sure you’re asked about it all the time, too. What advice can you offer to aspiring screenwriters about learning the craft and breaking into Hollywood?

Jon: I think you nailed it when you said learning the craft. People are either good storytellers or they’re not. I think the best thing that you can do is try to have a really good barometer of your own talent or your own skillset. There’s a lot of people that want to be screenwriters or directors or actors and they just don’t have it. It’s a tough pill to swallow, especially when you love movies, but to identify with your skill, or lack thereof, is paramount.

Also I’d advise to not worry about breaking into Hollywood so much. Obviously, that’s your hope. But, if that’s your goal, I think you’re going to slow yourself down. I feel the best thing is just to try to hone your craft and learn the process of writing as best you can.

Read a ton of scripts. I can’t advise that enough. Read as many scripts as you can get your hands on. Find the movies that you love, and then watch them, and then get the script and read it. Even read it while you’re watching the movie. Pause it. Look at how they did that. That taught me so much.

I think things like that are…I don’t know, I’m meandering along here, but I just think hone your craft and focus on writing as much as you can. Eventually, once you write that one thing that’s really great, it’ll find a home. I don’t know how, but it will.

For Part 1 of the interview, go here.

Part 2, here.

Part 3, here.

Part 4, here.

Part 5, here.

Jon is repped by WME and Zero Gravity Management.

Twitter: @jonboyer.